
I just got back from a whirlwind trip from Boston to New York... There seems to be a lot of questions flying around about ATi and NVIDIA’s competitive landscape. I have received many emails asking how things are looking from within Voodoo so I thought I would write a quick non-fiction, generalist standpoint so you can do your own analysis based on my experience.
First of all, what people need to understand about the GPU business is historically a major slaughtering of the competition only occurs when the other falls flat on their face. So if the green team falls flat, the red team skates by, and visa versa.
As an example, let’s look back a few years ago when Nvidia lost two product cycles. Back then Nvidia failed simply because they fell flat on their face with the much delayed much disappointing launch of the GeForce FX 5800 - while ATi skated by with their outstanding Radeon 9700. Prior to the beating, Nvidia was focusing many of their important engineering resources on the original XBOX and perhaps it was because of this that they missed out the win on the high end space. In this business if you lose on the high end you will ultimately lose on the mainstream.
If you asked me at that time roughly what our internal ratios between ATi and Nvidia were on the desktop I would have told you 100% ATi and 0% Nvidia. Nvidia knew they were losing the high end, and they were determined to change it.
The legend states that the CEO of Nvidia ultimately admitted defeat before his entire team and vowed to never take a back seat to anyone again. They joked publicly about their failed cooler unit on the GeForce FX 5800, and it seemed as if Nvidia had been humbled by their competition. Nvidia was a changed company (a serious heavyweight in the making); they started focusing on platform designs (SLI/Nforce4), better GPU technology (6800+), and of course the coolest notebook concept in years (MXM). Nvidia was determined to, at the very least, catch up in performance while schooling their competition on platform designs.
If you asked me two years ago roughly what our percentages were between ATi and Nvidia I would have told you they leaned towards Nvidia – eventually leading towards 100% Nvidia – this prior to ATi launching their x800 series. That’s a pretty insane change – not based on the other’s success, rather the competition’s failures.
Essentially ATi had fallen flat on their face with x800 and their initial Crossfire launch probably for the very same “Xbox Curse” that Nvidia happened to hit a couple of years earlier. The bottom line is ATi failed to recognize the potential NVIDIA’s focus on platforms such as SLI, and they focused huge resources on XBOX 360, therefore Nvidia conquered on multiple fronts.
We never really took ATi seriously at that point and the mainstream had no idea what was going on with the high end. The bottom line was ATi was not producing cards properly, they were mismanaging some relationships, and they misfired on Crossfire a few too many times. This led to the point where Voodoo was selling 100% Nvidia on the desktop side up until late 2005 to early 2006. Voodoo is on the bleeding edge - and what happens within our four walls typically expounds to the enthusiast market which ultimately leads to mainstream.
Thanks to Nvidia SLI they were able to sell two GPUs for every high end machine for a very long time, which meant we sold nearly twice as many boards as we ever had. That again confirmed their performance lead was dramatic. They gained more market share in the chipset market than ever before, even to the point where it seems like VIA and SIS all but gave up competing. Nvidia even bought ULI recently (a company that makes fantastic south bridge chipsets) for a song, basically eliminating the potential of any company competing with Nforce4. ATi tried but could never make a chipset worthy of a true enthusiasts PC. It seemed as if Nvidia could do no wrong. ...and really, they have done nothing too “wrong” since. They continue to be managed under their centralized approach, while ATi manages with their de-centralized approach. Both have advantages and disadvantages, which I may get into in a future article.
It was in late 2005 that we realized ATi was onto something with their X1900 series. ATi was about to release a card that would take them out of the stone age and back in competition with Nvidia. They may not be way ahead of the game, but they are way ahead of where they were and they have certainly caught up with their competition. The only drawback was that ATi launched Crossfire with the RD480 chipset, which was merely considered “okay” for us.
Meanwhile it seems as if ATi had locked a bunch of computer gamers in a room, one in particular who is very well known for his overclocking skills, and they were secretly designing the Xpress 3200 chipset. This is one bad-ass chip, it’s everything that an enthusiast chipset should be – and it’s amazingly overclockable. It’s probably among best motherboard chipset that I have seen to date, and that’s saying a lot – because I absolutely love Nforce4.
Let me be clear, ATi has never really made a killer motherboard chipset until now; and as of March 1st if you asked us our ratios I would tell you that ATi has done very well within Voodoo just based on the fact that they made a great package. We are about 50/50 at the moment in the extreme high end, based on all the positive press that we have been receiving, and that ratio seems to be sticking. Xpress 3200 with Crossfire technology combined with the Radeon X1900XTX has proven to be ATi’s white knight.
So again, that’s how it works in this space – in order to have a definitive slaughter over your competitor - they must absolutely fail miserably. If no one fails it's likely that we will be looking at a very even, very competitive horse race. At this point neither ATi nor Nvidia has failed and as far as many of us are concerned they are walking on nearly even territory with both shoelaces tied tightly.
With the success of the XBOX 360 (it could be MUCH more successful, I will be writing about that soon) and the upcoming Nintendo Revolution ATi will probably have a much better year than they’ve had in years. Of course there is the much delayed wearingly anticipated Sony PS3 for Nvidia – doubtful to launch in volume this year, but then again that’s typical with any console launch and it’s probably out of Nvidia’s hands. However, one cannot take away from Nvidia's dominance in the chipset market - including server.
There is the challenge that ATi faces of breaking into existing platforms. Nvidia practically owns the enthusiast chipset market on current platforms. While many people don’t mind going out and dropping a G-Note on a pair of video cards, once they have to spend another $100 or so on a motherboard the mind barrier takes over. Typically people believe once you need to replace the motherboard you might as well buy a new PC – that brings me to my next point.
ATi, still a bit bruised, may overcome this once Intel Conroe and AMD AM2 are launched. If ATi executes their chipsets on a timely manner, and they perform as well or better than the RD580 then it is most likely fair game. If ATi extends their chipsets into the server market then we're talking about an entirely different landscape.
ATi also has the distinct advantage of being able to work in Crossfire mode on an INTEL chipset – something I haven’t seen from Nvidia yet. Could that mean serious implications, or does it mean that Nvidia just has to flick a switch to make it work? Perhaps Nvidia prefers to eat Intel’s chipset market share with NFORCE 4 instead…. Perhaps both ATi and Nvidia will take chipset market from Intel as well. Time will tell.
This is going to be a great year for graphics; we finally have competition coming from both sides: Bring it on boys and girls, let innovation prevail!

25 blogger comments:
I agree that it will be an interesting year in graphics. I'm waiting to see DX10 - or whatever the current name is - cards. I personally have yet to purchase an ATi card, though they are in the lead now. It will be interesting also to see how 3200 lines up with nF 590. Who knows maybe I'll become ATi-friendly.
I was at CES when Dell launched nVidia's Quad SLI with Dell. What a joke that was. The Dell XPS unit was far from a performance machine even with the Quad SLI technology - compared to some of the dual SLI and even Crossfire liquid cooled systems available on the market.
I was even more surprised when this Dell unit suffered from overheating and so rumor has it that they kept the side panels off every to keep the demo PC’s from crashing. It’s too bad that nVidia couldn’t have débuted their new technology with pros like Voodoo or Falcon. At least they would have got it done right without all the fake marketing hype.
I have an SLI machine but I hope that if ATI goes down this path, they don’t make the same mistake. Perhaps weak marketing alliances like this one at CES, is a sign that things may turn the other direction. Go ATI!
Quad SLI has heavily overpromised and seriously underdelivered.
And I'm not even talking about just the driver issues, which I'm sure they'll be able to fix eventually (well, we've seen product launches with buggy drivers before). It seems to me that Quad SLI is seriously hindered in it's current form by a too large CPU overhead, as if there was any off-the-shelf CPU out there that could do it justice even under ideal conditions...
Making Quad SLI available in a smaller form (7950 GX2) is a step in the right direction, but the price is ludicrous and the gains I've yet to see materialise in more than a few selected games. There is only one game out there, which benefits greatly from the Quad SLI horsepower, and that is Oblivion.
nVidia tried to leap ahead, since they are losing the battle of SLI versus Crossfire in the high end segment. Unfortunately, it looks very much like they've tripped this time.
Ahti Tamm, technical writer, Estonia
I got the 9700 a few years back during that generation. It flat out rocked the FX series, and it lasted a long time for me. During that generation I decided I wouldn't ever get nVidia. They cheated on benchmarks, by a big margin, and that's just not cool with me. I don't care how good their cards are now, back then they were horrible and they felt they needed to cheat to stay competitive. I'm just not down with that. I have had zero problems with ATI so far so I have zero reason to switch, and one good reason to not switch.
On the other hand, history has taught us that eventually something mor epwerful will come up. I remember when we could buy two 16 MB GPU's... then 64 MB GPU's with more powerful cores were released, and everyone went back to using just one. What I would like to see is a ramp up like that again, as buying four or even two cards can be quite a blow to the pocket. When will we get to see 'dual core' GPUs and video RAM jumped up to mainstream 512 MB or 1024 MB? With an innovative approach, one could overcome any heating difficulties. Then, smaller form computers and more power efficient computers can be put into manufacturing process!
Hi Rahul,
I'm a big fan of your blog, specially when you make posts like this one, discussing the way the market goes.
I'd like to get your opinion on the future, based on what we see in the present.
From what I could gather in other websites, it seems that ATI's architecture is far more "next gen" then NVIDIA's. I mean, R520/R580 approach is kinda different from what we saw in the past (more horsepower with the same number of pipes and architectural improvements, 512-bit ring memory controller, etc.), while NVIDIA's is still focusing on "the bigger the better", increasing the power of the chip without changing it too much. The pratical result is that ATI is the undisputed champ on image quality, at the same time that NVIDIA holds on pretty well on the FPS/bang for the buck field.
Next gen, ATI's already announced that they're going the unified shaders way, which is the way MS recommends to Vista. They already have experience on that, as it is the way the XBOX360 GPU's are made. NVIDIA announced that they won't do that anytime soon, prefering a gradual transition to unified shaders.
Am I seeing too much (or too few) to say that ATI is preparing itself better for the future than NVIDIA? It doesn't reflect on the performance of today's products, but it seems to me the ATI's has a much clearer path in mind for the years to come.
Thanks for the insight.
Patrese (Brazil)
"They cheated on benchmark"
Yep. ATI has cheated on benchmarks too. Your point?
At the moment, neither seems to be cheating (although I'll give NVidia a few extra honesty points for at least allowing you to disable certain "fake" optimizations like "brilinear" filtering, which ATI doesn't even allow you to disable.
It's pretty dumb to "never" buy a certain brand because of what happened years ago. I've even forgiven ATI their lousy pre-Radeon drivers, and that took an almost superhuman effort... ;)
The entire point of this blog entry was that both companies have made huge blunders in the past, and both have recovered...
"they are losing the battle of SLI versus Crossfire in the high end segment"
Whooah, where do you get that idea from?
Did you check Valve's most recent hardware survey? It wasn't a close run, it wasn't even a slight lead, SLI held ~95% of the multi-GPU market. So, uh, losing? That's not exactly the word I'd use. ATI has some very attractive GPU's at the moment though, which does help Crossfire sales.
While we're all talking about ATi and nVidia's design choices, it's only fair to point out the visual aspects of how they're implemented. Case in point, I hate ATi's Crossire "hydra like" cabling that comes out the back. It looks horrible to be honest. You have companies like Voodoo and Falcon charging a whole lot extra for premium cases with fancy wiring jobs just to forget about the outside of the case. I love where nVidia and ATi are both going right now, but for the price a little extra R&D wouldn't hurt.
I am hoping that my nvidia 7900gt can be directX 10 capable with just a driver update. directX 10 should jsut allow the GPU to do more tasks normally assigned to the cpu. I would also like to see driver updates for physics processing on current smart shader 3.0 graphics cards. Why buy another card from Aegia, especially one that uses the pathetic pci bus. it's fun to watch nvidia and ATI one up eachother because it just gives the consumer more options and better products with each cycle.
Things move so fast in this space... i feel like i just picked up my 6800GT Q1 last year and now i'm feeling the need for an upgrade.
hopefully nvidia or ati will release a 7900gt level dx10 card for 299. that seems like a reasonable amount to pay for a shiny new card.
I love it that the graphics market is balanced/competitive at the highed now. The 7900gt and x1800xt are both 299. That's an awesome deal for both ATi and nVidia fans. Jusin, there are documented pre-r300 ATi cheats(quake3). So, I don't see how that can be the only deciding factor. Consumer mentality is soo much better than fanboyism.
Multichrome will r0x0rz joo
"Yep. ATI has cheated on benchmarks too. Your point?"
ATI's little "cheat" gave it less than 5% bonus. Nvidia's gave it a 26% boost. I didn't lose any sleep over ATI's optimization, but people were pissed about nvidia even before the truth came out. The FX line was horrid in performance, everyone knew it, but the benchmarks didn't show it. That's why it was investigated. ATI CONFESSED, nvidia got called on it. So I chose ATI. They have zero problems that I am aware of. I do not do Crossfire, never will, and SLI doesn't interest me either. I get the performance I need from one VC. So choosing to never pick Nvidia isn't a loss for me in the slightest. That cheating wasn't even the last BS they pulled, they did more stupid things in the next generation. The 7xxx series seems fine as far as I'm aware, but it doesn't matter to me anymore.
No offense Patrese, but if anyone has gone for "bigger is better" its ATI. Their current high end chip has over 100 million more transistors then NVIDIA's (384 million vs. 278).
I think ATI has some great ideas for their chips, and I definitely feel that ATI's current offerings are more future-proof then NVIDIA's, but... well... I imagine that's what you get for making a chip that's about a third larger.
In terms of lean/effective engineering/performance per transistor, right now though, NVIDIA is just killing ATI.
To Captain Andy
Well right now if your talking about transistor count your looking at 38% larger on the ATI front but if your talking about die size, ATI is 80% larger.
Nvidia's design focus for the 90nm G7x GPU has been cost effectiveness and bang for buck. ATI has been using this generation to prepare for the future it seems with that 512Bit internal ring bus memory controller.
Well I am getting a Crossfire solution delivered next week, two HIS x1900xt's and the latest DFI mobo with the 3200 chipset.
The only reason I have chosen Crossfire at this time is for HDR plus AA, which I will be using on the new Dell 2407 LCD (it will sure beat playing Oblivion on my current r9800 pro AIW at 800 x 600).
At this time performance isn't too different between SLI 7900 GTX and Crossfire x1900xt, it is more of a choice between high end features such as Transparency AA and HDR + AA (which there are a couple of game patches for at the moment).
Anyway I am sure as hell looking forward to a nice next week in Australia ;)
What I'm disappointed with ATI about is their mid-range lineup. They've failed in that area, TWICE. For two times they've launched mid-range chips that have similiar performance to their previous midrange chip (X600XT/X1600XT), switching only when they realized that their competitor's mid-range chip beats the previous top-end chip (6600GT/7600GT). ATI had better realized that the X2600XT, or whatever it is called, needs to be at least on par with the X1800XL, preferbly the X1800XT or above, else they'll still be playing the catch-up game. ATI may have more vision in terms of technology, but they don't seem to have vision in performance, at least as far as the mid-range market is concern. I'm sure that the X1600s would eventually get the price cut they need, but remember that ATI already had to slash its price against the 6800GS. Having to slash prices of a product dramatically, twice, in less than six months, does not bade well for the product.
For the poster who said he wishes that a driver update will enable DX 10 on his card, he can go on dreaming. first off that is not going to be a possibility because DX 10 requires SM 4.0. Second of all, you really think companies like ATI and Nvidia are going to do something that will benefit the end user? They want to make the max amount of money imaginable and that means they need to keep pushing newer and more powerful hardware. So keep dreaming. It is a nice dream but one that is not going to happen. I love ATI and Nvidia products. I wouldnt be unhappy with either. But I do hope ATI comes into the server space and I do hope ATI fixes their slow USB performance.
"nVidia tried to leap ahead, since they are losing the battle of SLI versus Crossfire in the high end segment. Unfortunately, it looks very much like they've tripped this time.}
I believe you are heavily mistaken, to put it nicely.
Whenver the Geforce 7900 series cards came out, and benchmarks were immediatly posted, while the Radeon x1900XTX tended to slightly out-do the Geforce 7900GTX is several of the cases, the Dual Geforce 7900GTX SLI configuration still managed to outperfom the Two x1900XTX's in Crossfire, even when the single x1900XTX outperformed the single Geforce 7900GTX. I'd encourage you to take a look at those benchmarks.
Aside from having the performance lead, though, SLI just happens to be the more attractive solution when you start talking about conveniance. With an x1900XTX you are forced to buy the retail card, and then a seperate master card, and then you have things connected with an external dongle that many feel is just plain annoying and unattractive (which is why I ultimately opted out of going Crossfire). I realize that these issues are mostly with the highend cards, but let's get serious, what sane gamer is really going to buy two Radeon x1600's when a single x1900XT is about just as powerful for a little more.
Anywho, I think you couldn't be farther from the truth by saying nVidia is loosing the SLI battle to Crossfire. In fact, I think it's the other way around, that SLI is actually broadening in the market.
But I guess your justification for that claim was the fact that nVidia went ahead and released Quad-Sli, in which case, how can you associate the release of a new technology to the receeding dominance of another?
Anywho, great article.
"But I guess your justification for that claim was the fact that nVidia went ahead and released Quad-Sli, in which case, how can you associate the release of a new technology to the receeding dominance of another? "
Thats easy enough to argue against (and its Nvidia by the way) - when a company releases a product that is obviously not ready for the market, and more so when its ludicrously expensive and virtually no market for, is a sign of weakness. Wasting resources on a product only to leave it a bit underfunded to perform properly isnt the smartest thing in the world to do.
I will have to agree with the anonymous poster above rotosequence. Just because quad SLI is not that great yet does not mean that it will remain a half-assed product like this forever. The battle is just warming up and Nvidia has fired the warning shot. It does produce some impressive performance in a few games there is no doubt about it.
When will either ATI or Nvidia realize there's another whole niche they're missing: passively cooled GPUs with decent but not necessarily blazing performance. If they took one of their previous generation chips and produced it with the latest 90nm process a lot of people would choose this for quiet rigs.
I for one HATE the loudness and unreliability of fan-cooled graphics cards. Power consumption on CPU's is decreasing, why don't the graphics chips makers notice the trend?
To Rick:
Asus, Gigabyte and other boards makers do sell passively cooled cards. Gigabyte tends to use Zalman heatpipes and they make a 7600GT SLI card that is passively cooled.
@above:
There ARE passively cooled X1300s, X1600s (I think - not sure about this), 7600GS, 7600GTs, and 7800GTs, you know.
I think even XFX has some passively cooled ones.
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